Chat What's more important- Players or Tactics?

[norm9]

Here's a question I've been thinking about while I waste some time at work. 

What do you think is more important to a team's success? Is it the players you sign or the tactics you employ?

On here and elsewhere on the net, you have people with "Undefeated tactic!" or "Won Champions League with a Vanarama team and THIS tactic!" and yet, every time I give those tactics a run or two, they just don't work for me. Or sometimes they do, but not to the extent of their hyperbole.

Then there's signing every big name out there with Barca or Real Madrid and you've got yourself some trophies. This doesn't really work for me either even when I try to tweak the tactics or just use the default tactics.

So what say you? Do you create a tactic first and fill the gaps, or do you get the players and let the chips fall based on their abilities?

[Dhxn]

For me, i implement my style of play in my style of tactics. The players i choose are stat dependent on the formation. This makes tactics very good in my opinion 

[Prevalence]

Some Tactics are favoured by the engine more than others. Some Tactics are not viable regardless of the players. 

However the degree to which your player's attributes are appropriate for the tactic does affect it's effectiveness :-) I think there is a balance.

Edited March 9, 2018 by Prevalence

[Scratch]

I'm still stuck on FMM 2017 (trying to reach 1.5K goals, taking a while!), might not be the same on FMM 2018, but I've always found the players are more important. Ideally you have both of course! But if you can only have one I'd go with better players and an average tactic over the other way around.

As @Prevalence points out, there are some tactics that find holes in the match engine and make you win everything, but I've never had much luck finding them (I know others have). And there are some tactics that will not work well no matter what... But if you get a reasonable tactic, then great players are the key to making it work. 

Starting in FMM 2017, it seemed they made it so tactics would work for a while then stop being quite so effective, then work again later (probably quite similar to real life). But if you have great players, they will make it work all the time.

In my FMM 2017 1KCs, I went with a variation of the 4 3 2 1 formation that seemed to do well for most people. When I started (with Celtic), it worked well, then went cold, then came back. After a couple of seasons I had upgraded the players significantly and it worked all the time and I'd only lose a handful of games. A few more seasons and I had truly world class players and I started going undefeated and winning the Champions League every year. Tactics worked great! But when I started out (remembering I still had very good players for the division I was in), it wasn't consistent at all. 

Of course, sometimes it's better to have a very good player that fits your tactic as opposed to a truly great player who doesn't (eg regens of Ronaldo and Messi weren't as important to me as Pavon, who is very good but not at their level, because he filled the role of provider for my striker).

[mcandrew003]

I'd say players, yet you can have a side of world renowned players and lose. You need a decent shape and instructions to incorporate the playing styles of your individuals. However I also MASSIVELY agree with @scratch99and believe players are integral. It's about finding a balance.

[rafa]

Short answer: players.

Not so long answer: you will definitely have more success with a standard tactic and awesome players than with the “best” tactic and average players.

Long answer: to really outperform odds and be “unbeatable” there is no magic formula. A great tactic will be not so great with the wrong players, the best players will perform poorly in the wrong setup. To consistently perform well you need the players, a suitable tactic and ability to tweak it according to the match circumstances.

[Dar J]

I'd say the most important thing is getting the best out of the players. 

When I create a tactic for a particular team with certain players, that tactic never works for another thing unless I tweak it to suit the team or sign similar kind of players 

[Giffen]

Both

you won't perform good if you have a world class side with a dreadful tactic.

I have ran a great Tactic with a not so good side and went unbeaten in every game in back to back seasons. 

[Meestercat]

For me it’s tactics. I get squeamish about spending money, even at richer clubs, so my players are very rarely great. Instead I prefer tactics that make the most of what I have - I find this more interesting and fun.

Edited March 9, 2018 by Meestercat

[Rob]

I’d also add that I think it is also important to play the right players in the right positions - I.e. play them in their specialised role, not a secondary role. But that’s just my opinion. 

[Prevalence]

On 09/03/2018 at 12:13, scratch99 said:

there are some tactics that find holes in the match engine and make you win everything

I wouldn't say 'holes' per se, but is very difficult to design a match engine that doesn't have some kind of nuance generally favouring a particular set up or element of a set up. If there was an unbeatable formation, the game would be broken and no fun at all.

I've not come across a formation (yet) that works well when the players don't suit it. 

[Scratch]

10 hours ago, Prevalence said:

I wouldn't say 'holes' per se, but is very difficult to design a match engine that doesn't have some kind of nuance generally favouring a particular set up or element of a set up. If there was an unbeatable formation, the game would be broken and no fun at all.

I've not come across a formation (yet) that works well when the players don't suit it. 

Yeah, it's much harder to find a *great* tactic these days - and by these days I mean 2017, which I'm still on! 2018 is probably different again. In the older days it was easier. So props to SI Games for that.

And for sure you need to have players to suit a formation - I totally agree with that! I guess I'm saying that great players make the formations work (presumably because they suit the formation). But they can even make slightly dodgy formations work. 

Eg: Want to play 2 at the back, 5 across central midfield and 3 up front? No problem (in 2017) if you have *great* centre backs and goalie. They can cope, even though a) no team would play that in real life and b) even good teams would get slaughtered in FMM. 

Anyway, I think we're probably agreeing! 

[Titjes]

1 minute ago, scratch99 said:

Yeah, it's much harder to find a *great* tactic these days - and by these days I mean 2017, which I'm still on! 2018 is probably different again. In the older days it was easier. So props 

Eg: Want to play 2 at the back, 5 across central midfield and 3 up front? No problem (in 2017) if you have *great* centre backs and goalie. They can cope, even though a) no team would play that in real life and b) even good teams would get slaughtered in FMM. 

This works on 2018 also with some tweaks