Chat In theory can this player make it in the Premier League?

[David_1276]

Hi, so, er, this one may get pretty long but I'll go for it anyway.

I manage my favourite non league (IRL) team and have done for the last 3 or 4 iterations of FMM, but I have never really considered this prospect. So, basically, I've taken Southport to 9th in League 2 in October, which is actually quite poor given my experience of winning Champions Leagues with this team and the depth of squad I have, alas, however, got this player who has been released at youth level by Man United and seemed a decent prospect for my then-conference side to take a chance on. In his first season as you can see he hit it off really well as we hoovered up all the non league accolades, with him being a key member of that team as a 16 year old, only the second time that has ever really happened to me on this game, and the first for 2 years. 

Also, if you look at his morale it is pretty much always "Superb" and his personality is "Professional" as well as having the ability to grow exponentially according to Chris Smalling (Who has a bronze qualification.) Also, his stats are decent, he gets a lot of game time for his age and pretty much everything Smalling or the other coach ever says are always positive. 

Also, as you can see he has 5 star league 2 potential, which I think means he minimum can be 2 star in the Prem if he makes it that far? But at the start of the season he had just 4 1/2 star potential, meaning he would probably have exactly 5 star and no more in terms of league 2 potential. However what I'm saying is, and my question, is can he still grow to be like 4 star premier league if I keep him in the team? He doesn't have the best potential in the team because when I sort the squad from highest potential he is only the 6th, is that random or do they sort by the theoretical maximum potential a player can have if they were at a top division club? That is to say the likes of Elia Petrelli would be a better player than Damon Craig off potential? 

Finally, considering temperament, work rate, skill and morale are all pretty decent do you think he can grow to be that club legend (3.5 to 5 star prem) I'm after? As he ticks all the boxes of being a local, young, likeable and versatile team player.

Sorry for the length, and thanks in advance!

Edited January 2, 2020 by David_1276

[Scratch]

I don't think there is a proper answer for this (unless you use the editor to find out his real PA). From what I can see above he looks like a candidate for what you want, but you won't know for sure until he maxes out his development - which will be years later.

He's got a good base of attributes for his age, he seems to have a lot of potential (just how much is the question), good mental qualities, good youth team stats for Man U before they ditched him, etc.

I think he's likely to grow into a least a good solid team player at PL level. Whether he can be more and become a PL legend though... perhaps, perhaps not. There's only one way to find out! 😄

[MikeF]

Very low technique - I would say no to making it at a high level. Might be good for lower league though so develop him and see what happens. 
 

I would keep him training as a right winger or midfielder though. Doesn’t look too good as striker. Low shooting and high teamwork. I like my strikers selfish!

Edited January 3, 2020 by MikeF

[SophiaFM]

Very versatile, can easily be good enough as a squad PL player 🙂

[Scratch]

2 hours ago, MikeF said:

Very low technique - I would say no to making it at a high level. Might be good for lower league though so develop him and see what happens.

I'm never really sure what to make of Technique. Yeah, higher the better, but how important is it really in FMM? I mean I had a striker with a Technique of 8 that had scored 1K goals by the age of 28... World Player of the Year multiple times... 

[broodje kip]

Seems good enough for the Premier League if he could play regularly he could be a great goalscorer or creator

[Mr Tree]

tasty stats and average for his age. i'm no expert but i'd be enthused. i had the same thought as Mike though, i like my young potentials to have good Technique, it's generally a good sign...

one thing that Scratch put me on to last year, and then i used it on two 16yo Polish strikers who eventually won multiple Champs Leagues and achieved the DT challenge together - as they're coming through, good performances will lead to stats boosts (is he still increasing in the screen at the end of games?) - so it can be worth taking him off when you make a substitution if he's already on 7+ to "make sure" he maintains the rating and it doesn't sink to a six in the last few minutes (depriving you of the boost). maybe a bit easier with strikers but it worked a treat. the career before, i was trying to slowly bleed in a young striker from the bench, but he regularly got 6's which meant he didn't grow well enough...

[CloudyDay]

5 hours ago, Scratch said:

I'm never really sure what to make of Technique. Yeah, higher the better, but how important is it really in FMM? I mean I had a striker with a Technique of 8 that had scored 1K goals by the age of 28... World Player of the Year multiple times... 

On that note, I fail to understand the logic behind Technique being an important attribute for a Poacher instead of an Advanced Forward. Someone like Vardy for instance, is as close to a prototypical poacher as it gets but you wouldn't consider him a very 'technical' player at his level. Contrast this to someone like Anthony Martial who I think fits the Advanced Forward image quite well, he relies quite a bit on his technical skills to score (dribbling tricks and shot placements).

Back on topic, I don't really care much for Technique for my strikers because I almost always run either a Poacher or a Target Man, two roles that I don't think Technique matters that much on. I care more if it's for an Inside Forward and usually try to aim for 12+ (which is a very low bar to clear tbh) and maybe Box to Box Midfielders if I want some long shots from him but that's more of a luxury than anything. To answer OP's question, I think Damon Craig is a good prospect right now though obviously we don't know if he'll be a PL-caliber player. I think he could be a decent left winger with his attributes, in a few years or less he should hit green's for his dribbling, movement and pace which should be enough for at least a bench role I think. 9 for technique is really good for a guy his age on a league 2 side imo.

Edited January 3, 2020 by CloudyDay

[David_1276]

Ok thanks everybody - I didn't expect so many responses! In reply to Mr Tree, he does still develop massively (6-10% when he plays well) at the end of each match so there seems to be no stifling there. As for the technique thing I'm probably going to morph him into more of a CM where I'd say it doesn't matter quite as much as on the wing or as a striker (Though I often run TM so he wouldn't fit there anyway.)

[Ian]

Looks a decent prospect to me. His mental attributes in particular look really good as they often increase with age so to get them as high as that in a youngster is promising. In regards to technique, last year I’m pretty sure it couldn’t be improved but this year I’ve had a player improve there with putting the training focus to that so that’s what I’d do if I was you. I’ve convinced myself rightly or wrongly that technique includes first touch so I really rate its importance and especially for midfielders. Last year when managing a top team I’d look for 13 for both technique and teamwork as minimum but with them both being improvable this year it makes it a lot easier.

[Mr Tree]

I'm with you Ian, I think Technique is basically "first touch" and similar...

[MikeF]

7 hours ago, Scratch said:

I'm never really sure what to make of Technique. Yeah, higher the better, but how important is it really in FMM? I mean I had a striker with a Technique of 8 that had scored 1K goals by the age of 28... World Player of the Year multiple times... 

I find it a good indicator for young players but mostly ones who are going to play in a creative role. Midfield or IF/Wingers. Not so much for strikers. I see technique as first touch but also skill on the ball (how easy it is for someone to get ball off them). When a player has low technique coach reports tends to see ‘not good on the ball’ or similar which backs this up. 
 

As you say though you get world class players with low technique esp with defenders who just need to get a big tackle in or a striker who just needs to hit the thing! I agree it seems odd a poacher having technique as a key attribute and they should really just have to have good decisions And movement to when make the right run and then shooting to hit it! AF or Treq should have technique if anything or even DLF as a creative link player but that’s all a side line to this convo. 
 

The main reason I mentioned his low technique is I don’t think he’ll make a good striker. He looks better suited to a deeper role and for that I prefer a higher technique. 
 

Interested to see how he turns out though. @David_1276 you’ll have to stick this save out now so we can see his development 😂 

[David_1276]

2 minutes ago, MikeF said:

I find it a good indicator for young players but mostly ones who are going to play in a creative role. Midfield or IF/Wingers. Not so much for strikers. I see technique as first touch but also skill on the ball (how easy it is for someone to get ball off them). When a player has low technique coach reports tends to see ‘not good on the ball’ or similar which backs this up. 
 

As you say though you get world class players with low technique esp with defenders who just need to get a big tackle in or a striker who just needs to hit the thing! I agree it seems odd a poacher having technique as a key attribute and they should really just have to have good decisions And movement to when make the right run and then shooting to hit it! AF or Treq should have technique if anything or even DLF as a creative link player but that’s all a side line to this convo. 
 

The main reason I mentioned his low technique is I don’t think he’ll make a good striker. He looks better suited to a deeper role and for that I prefer a higher technique. 
 

Interested to see how he turns out though. @David_1276 you’ll have to stick this save out now so we can see his development 😂 

Oh don't worry, I do one of these with Southport every year and usually get 15+ years into the job so we Will be able to see his development, honestly I think he could make it better than any of my other players on the roster atm which is why I brought him here!

[Ian]

One thing that is slightly putting me off the player is his value isn’t particularly high and I find that a good indicator of the players potential. When I was managing Italy on my Juve save last year I went down the regen route a lot earlier than I normally would due to managing Italy and would try to get all of the good young Italian players for Juve to develop them. Anyway, I didn’t use any real fancy system for scouting them other than looking at the attributes that I knew wouldn’t improve and making sure they were okay and then the players value. If I saw two young defenders with similar attributes and one valued at £100k and the other at say £1m, I’d go for the £1m guy and it seemed to be a good way of going about it as I ended up with a conveyer belt of talent.

[David_1276]

14 minutes ago, Ian said:

One thing that is slightly putting me off the player is his value isn’t particularly high and I find that a good indicator of the players potential. When I was managing Italy on my Juve save last year I went down the regen route a lot earlier than I normally would due to managing Italy and would try to get all of the good young Italian players for Juve to develop them. Anyway, I didn’t use any real fancy system for scouting them other than looking at the attributes that I knew wouldn’t improve and making sure they were okay and then the players value. If I saw two young defenders with similar attributes and one valued at £100k and the other at say £1m, I’d go for the £1m guy and it seemed to be a good way of going about it as I ended up with a conveyer belt of talent.

Yeah I usually take value to mean more of the value to the team if you get me but as you can see since this post he has grown a lot in value, and also a little in CA

[David_1276]

18 minutes ago, Ian said:

One thing that is slightly putting me off the player is his value isn’t particularly high and I find that a good indicator of the players potential. When I was managing Italy on my Juve save last year I went down the regen route a lot earlier than I normally would due to managing Italy and would try to get all of the good young Italian players for Juve to develop them. Anyway, I didn’t use any real fancy system for scouting them other than looking at the attributes that I knew wouldn’t improve and making sure they were okay and then the players value. If I saw two young defenders with similar attributes and one valued at £100k and the other at say £1m, I’d go for the £1m guy and it seemed to be a good way of going about it as I ended up with a conveyer belt of talent.

Oh and also at 17 he is my 3rd most valuable player despite loan signings, however I believe that is also probably down to the fact he is one of only 4 or 5 key players in my team?

Edited January 3, 2020 by David_1276
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[Mr Tree]

are you training him as an AF? what's his "natural" position? (i don't have many training recommendations though, i just leave it to asst)

[MikeF]

16 minutes ago, Mr Tree said:

are you training him as an AF? what's his "natural" position? (i don't have many training recommendations though, i just leave it to asst)

His profile says young midfielder and coach page says MR. I’d train him as as an AP in CM position or a right winger. 

[David_1276]

58 minutes ago, Mr Tree said:

are you training him as an AF? what's his "natural" position? (i don't have many training recommendations though, i just leave it to asst)

Naturally he is a right midfielder but I have trained him in a lot of different positions just to add to his versatility as an attacking option. I almost always play him winger at left wing atm but eventually I intend to make him into an AP or BBM at CM, as I feel that would best suit him. Also look at his technique since I put it as the focus role! I'd guess that's most likely because his development did the level up thing last match and it has happened a few times over the last 2 months or so.

[Mr Tree]

niice! we'll look forward to more updates then!

[Thepremiermanager]

In terms of technique and poachers, wouldn't one need good technique as many of their attempts are likely to be first time hits etc which need good technique so as not to scuff them, or the ability to gather in a pass and then shoot i.e. first touch

Your guy definitely looks more of a CM to me. Higher dribbling and passing combined with good movement and teamwork, I'd go with a B2B mid eventually. 

[MikeF]

7 hours ago, Thepremiermanager said:

In terms of technique and poachers, wouldn't one need good technique as many of their attempts are likely to be first time hits etc which need good technique so as not to scuff them, or the ability to gather in a pass and then shoot i.e. first touch

Yeah good point.

[Ian]

Good to see his technique improve so quickly. It’ll be interesting to see how high it goes.

[Scratch]

21 hours ago, MikeF said:

I find it a good indicator for young players but mostly ones who are going to play in a creative role. Midfield or IF/Wingers. Not so much for strikers. I see technique as first touch but also skill on the ball (how easy it is for someone to get ball off them). When a player has low technique coach reports tends to see ‘not good on the ball’ or similar which backs this up. 
 

As you say though you get world class players with low technique esp with defenders who just need to get a big tackle in or a striker who just needs to hit the thing! I agree it seems odd a poacher having technique as a key attribute and they should really just have to have good decisions And movement to when make the right run and then shooting to hit it! AF or Treq should have technique if anything or even DLF as a creative link player but that’s all a side line to this convo. 
 

The main reason I mentioned his low technique is I don’t think he’ll make a good striker. He looks better suited to a deeper role and for that I prefer a higher technique. 
 

Interested to see how he turns out though. @David_1276 you’ll have to stick this save out now so we can see his development 😂 

Thanks for the explanation - I always wondered and that makes total sense to me.

That said, in this year and last years version, I pretty much ignore Technique for my striker. I make sure I get them to Aerial 20 and play them as AF and the goals rain. So I'm guessing FMM isn't quite as clever in this case as it should be. What a surprise! 😄 

added 0 minutes later

12 hours ago, Ian said:

Good to see his technique improve so quickly. It’ll be interesting to see how high it goes.

Yeah, that is pretty amazing, look forward to an update on his development later!