Chat Re-training gives a slight attribute boost.

[RPA123456]

Something I came across elsewhere in this forum was that re-training gave a slight attribute boost, it didn't have any accompanying photos but the person who said it is a Key Player of this forum(can anyone guess who it is?)

But being skeptical, I had to test it out for myself. 

This is the player before he got naturally trained in the position.(Winger in the midfield) 

And here he is a month later, right after I got the message from my assman saying he's fully trained. 

He went up:

+1 crossing

+1 dribbling 

+1 passing

+1 stamina

4 attribute points. 

Now it's not much, but it is something. 

Now I just have a few more questions about it, and I hope some of the other members here can help me anwser them. 

Do these points take up CA? I suspect they're similar to coach attribute boosts and such don't take up CA points, but I'm not sure. 

Are these attribute boosts permanent? I have a doubt that once retrained to another position, the gained attributes would disappear. 

Does this mean that continuously training your players to play as many roles as possible is the best way to go about improving your players? Even if this is true, since the game heavily takes CA into account I fear it may still be not too useful.(I hope I'm wrong on that one) 

 

 

[RPA123456]

Another update to this, I retrained the same player again(this time to wing back in defense) 

Here he is before(he had a normal training upgrade the time in between the last update) 

And here he is right after I got the retrained to be natural message from my assman

He went up:

+1 crossing

+1 dribbling

+2 positioning 

Another 4 attribute points. 

 

 

 

[RPA123456]

Yet another update to this(I hope this isn't considered as spam) 

This time I used another, older player. Someone who no doubt has already reached the ceiling of his potential. 

Here he is before(being retrained into a wing back in the dm strata) 

And here he is after(I have two ss because my game crashed once and I had to restart a save and went back to a save before the ass man message) 

In this save he went up:

+2 dribbling

+1 tackling

+1 positioning

While in this one he went up:

+1 dribbling

+1 tackling

+1 positioning

Now this is a player that had already reached his potential, but here we are with attributes going up despite that. 

So with that, I think it's safe to conclude that retraining players gives a nice free 3-4 attribute point boost. 

What do ya'll think lads? 

 

Edited March 5, 2020 by RPA123456

[BatiGoal]

Interesting. I've had a slightly different experience but never really experimented other than in that single career I did. So I assumed that's how things worked, but apparently not as it may differ per save?

What happened was that I retrained pretty much all my players for better coverage, versatility etc. but I noticed a bump in the "new" attributes like you, but but at the same time a drop in his previous ones. All players in that same save had the same thing happen. So now I never retrain my first 11 in order to keep them specific to their player roles, and retrain the entire bench only. 

I suppose some experiments are in order. 

[Mr Tree]

Yep don't think this is spam mate, it's useful research. I don't go overboard with retraining but I do like my full-backs or wingers to be able to cover both sides, etc. Not noticed a stat bump - will look out for it next time. And then @Scratch or others might be able to help with regards to whether this is a "free" boost or whether it comes out of their ability to improve otherwise.....

[Scratch]

I've got a theory on this, but it's long and it's by no means certain (just my guess):

I believe the very first version of FMM20 had the old bug from a few years ago, where you could retrain a player again and again and again in position they were already bright green for, and the player would end up as epic (ie small increases like shown above each time you retrained them).

I didn't test it extensively, but I read about it here and was surprised because that used to be a thing in either FMM18 or 19 and I thought it had been fixed. So I did a small test and confirmed that the bug existed. At that point in time (assume it's still the same, but haven't tested), CA was NOT increased through this, so effectively they were free attribute increases.

Then came the first update for FMM20 and of course retraining was broken. You couldn't retrain players in positions that they were bright green for and it kept reverting to their original position, even though you didn't want them to play as that. My suspicion at the time was that SIGames were trying to fix the never ending retraining thing and just went a bit overboard. 

Then they fixed retraining in the 2nd update and since then you can retrain someone in a position they are already bright green in, BUT you don't get the "Player is now natural in this position" message. I assumed that meant that no extra attribute points are assigned either. But I never tested it. 

My guess is that what @RPA123456 is seeing is that original retraining bump, which likely still exists, but only happens when you fully retrain a player in a position that they are not bright green in. And the endless retraining of bright green positions is a thing of the past.

As for how much of a bump it is, I suspect that relies on different factors so it can be different people. When I did my test, the bumps weren't normally as big as the ones above, more like 1 or 2 points, sometimes none (though occasionally it'd be 3 or 4).

Sometimes some attributes would go up and others would go down (more on that in a minute), but the net effect would always be an improvement (at least for me) - eg 3 attributes up a point and 1 attribute a point down.

Now we're getting way, way into guess work here: When working on the scouting app I'm creating, I found a value that seems to change the player's shape. Increase that value and maybe their dribbling will fall and their tackling will improve etc. My guess is that's related somehow to the player's ideal position - so in the above eg, maybe I changed them from a winger shaped player to a centre back shaped player.

It doesn't change which position they can play, that's stored elsewhere, just their ... shape. So my guess is that when you retrain a player it changes their shape, which changes their attributes. For some reason when you do this it seems to have a net increase effect (at least for me) - not sure why... I would have though it would even out and not increase.

Anyway, that's my best guess - it's pretty much impossible to work out, only SIGames will know what's actually going on.

[RPA123456]

That is really fascinating! @Scratch

So a change(positive most of the time) in attributes when retraining is an actual feature. 

Hmmmm this is interesting and opens up a nice little reward of sorts for people who like to micromanage training. 

I'll post more updates with pictures soon. 

Personally I think this is a really neat and fun feature, and while some may argue it's broken I'll say it's fun. 

[Scratch]

I guess it makes sense actually... If you retrain as a winger, your crossing and dribbling will probably improve for example, just through the retraining. And you probably won't forget how to tackle.

That said, I personally don't worry about this. I retrain players to fit my system or to be emergency backups, but don't do it for this reason. Instead I get 3 or 4 good youngsters for each position and see which ones develop. I normally find one who turns out so good that a few attributes here or there don't make much difference. 😆 But that's because I'm at a good club, might be more important lower down.

[Mr Tree]

Nothing for me, I don't think...