Chat FMM20 Tactical principles

[Bamb00zle]

I see a lot of people posting their tactics up but I see less threads on the principles behind certain ways of playing. I thought I'd try and get some discussion going on this.

This version is obviously much stripped down from the PC game but how would you set up your team to do the following and why. What formations would you go for? What roles would you use? What about shape/defence/attack settings?

Possession based tactics

Counter attack tactics

Park the bus systems

Pressing based systems

Low block systems

Attacking tactics

This thread is designed to share experience and get people who are maybe new to the game to think and analyse how the different components fit together to create a good tactic. 

Feel free to share how you play and what style you want to achieve or have achieved. If you're struggling, ask some advice, maybe the community can help.

Cheers

[Gammamammam]

Hello there,

I'm much of a Guardiola and Wenger in the sense that I prefer to have possession in most games I play so I usually set up to control or attack the opposition, I almost always set up in wide, fast and expressive football but I have grown tired of doing that and now prefer wide, and slow to recycle possession and disciplined positioning to make sure there is a lack of holes in my team.

I often find that the best form of defense is to press the life out of the opposition and then either hit teams straight away with a counter attack or work the ball back around safely, usually I'd ignore the offside trap in the off chance that it would distract low decision making players to decide not to get stuck in and a high defensive line helps with all over pressing. 

When attacking I prefer short passing so much more than mixed, direct or long styles and that suits my ideology of recycling possession safely. I set up with mixed passing focus because I would prefer to use all of the pitch whenever possible. I also like the keeper distribution to be short because I like build up play which leads me to use work into the box but whether or not I use look for overlap depends on if I'm using wing backs or inverted full backs.

I almost exclusively use the 4-3-3 as the basic principle of shape and usually find myself using either the 4-2-3-1 or 4-1-2-2-1/2-3-2-2-1 depending on where I want wing backs to run again. I've tried to start using 3/5 at the back formations but because it's easier to instruct a team to end up attacking in a 2-3-5 shape when the ball reaches the final third I tend to stick with the 4-3-3 philosophy though I may start trying to trial a librero to play in the back line

The reason I think most these things is because I drew a lot of inspiration from how Pep and Klopp influenced Premier League football as I am british and they are the major managers in my freshmen year of understanding football properly. 

 

[BatiGoal]

7 hours ago, Bamb00zle said:

Possession based tactics

If I share my views on all the types of tactics you mentioned in the OP I'll need another 4-5 hours. Instead I'll pick one every few days and share my thoughts on how I went (or would go) about it. In this particular one, the possession based tactic, I spent 3-4 days last week trying to perfect the playing style needed to end each game with the highest possession % possible. An attempt to break the then record that stood on 80% but primarily just as a challenge for myself. After many games and tweaks I ended up with a formation that generated a pretty high average % vs strong teams approx 60-65%, vs mid-table teams 65-70% and vs the weak 70-75%. It peaked at 81% which just barely broke the record. But it's a one off. 

Here's the end result with a few answers:

First off, if you want to play possession football and dominate every opponent you'll need solid players. I can win games with weak players when needed, well if things go my way, but to dominate much stronger AI is virtually impossible so you'll need to pick decent/good players for the positions above. What attracted me about possession football is that it's more time on the ball for me and less for the opponent. It comes at a price tho, sort of, all that possession is needed to find and exploit chinks in the armor. This takes time and often results in fewer chances than your regular tactic, but in general there's fewer needed as we become more efficient. I love my "create 20 chances and score 6-7gls" as well, but this is just a different type of football for the fans. On the 2-5-3 formation:

After many tests I found that going with a flat 5 gives the highest average. Sometimes opting for a reversed 3-5-2 which works very well too but the key by far is the 5 in midfield. It did better in terms of possession % than any triangles or diamonds I experimented with. 

CDs - just solid defenders that pass the ball to the next guy. Two is enough if they're great. Not so great then try going with 3 at the back. 

WMs - reliable wide men that play without many risks of losing the ball. Fewer chances than your traditional Winger but better possession wise. And since there's no FBs, this or DWs makes better sense. 

CMs - as simple as they come. Link both ends without trying anything funny. Most other roles are risky in one way or another so these are, again, the perfect roles to keep possession of the ball. 

BWM - in order to keep my % as high as possible I needed a "thief" in my team in case one of my players lost the ball, so hence his inclusion. Everytime an opponent touches the ball our % drops, so we need a top BWM right in the middle. 

TM - strong physical lad to keep and hold the ball so the rest of the team has time to move forward and/or reorganize. Any player(role) who holds off opponents should make the team if you're thinking of playing possession football imo. 

IFs - I wanted to keep play wide up front, to create space in the box, and at the same time provide enough firepower to convert the few chances we create. IFs seemed perfect for the job. I tried DFs and DLFs but not as effective. Disappointing tbh as I initially had high hopes for the two roles. 

 

There's a few more thoughts behind my decisions that led to this formation as it was a lot of trial and error (lots of error 😂 etc etc) but in short this was the thinking process over that period of time. Any questions feel free to ask. 

[KG4]

@BatiGoal love the look of that and possession based football is right up my street. Is the full tactic successful in terms of winning games?

[BatiGoal]

1 hour ago, KG4 said:

@BatiGoal love the look of that and possession based football is right up my street. Is the full tactic successful in terms of winning games?

With solid teams it is. Portugal, Argentina, Brazil, Italy, perfect but weaker teams you may need to switch to 3-5-2. As for the shape as seen in screenshot:

Defensive - I tried all of them but this one generated best results. Probably because it focuses on ball retention more than the others. 

Wide - I often play Narrow but Wide gives higher % on average. I'm guessing due to the flat midfield 5 which is packed enough as is. Even more so if we were to close the distance. Wide would be more difficult to defend against in this case due to stretched play but still enough people to cover the grass in that area. 

Fast - this is a tricky one. So many thoughts went thru my head and I was convinced that Slow Tempo was the way to go. Meaning more time having my players on the ball, more possession etc etc but I was wrong. Fast in my opinion meant my attack was going to end sooner or my players were more prone to mistakes. But ultimately it also means it's much harder to defend against opposed to play slow, easier to read etc. So Fast in this case does result in higher %. 

Disciplined - simply no risk football. Balanced alternatively. Boring to the fans probably but for the challenge I set this was the way forward. Players stay put except for BWM, pass to the next guy, no funny tricks left or right. They do the job and go home like the unsung heroes they are. 

That's what goes into trying to reach the next level 😁 sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. 

[KG4]

Cheers for the response mate. The fast surprised me but suited a flat 3-5-2 with fast before and had high percentage. Love seeing detailed posts like this 👍🏻

[BatiGoal]

10 minutes ago, KG4 said:

Cheers for the response mate. The fast surprised me but suited a flat 3-5-2 with fast before and had high percentage. Love seeing detailed posts like this 👍🏻

Welcome, there's more time at home these days so more time for lengthy posts. To add about the Fast option, I think it's directly linked to players' Decisions more than anything else. You can afford to play this "risky" way with many good decision makers in the team, but low numbers here and it's probably best to turn it down a notch and give them more thinking time on the ball. 

[Hugofernando]

I really like play with attacking tactics, i've tried a lot of shapes, 433, 22231, 3232, 22123...but i cant score 130 goals+ even in weak leagues, like league one(with PSG)  i guess my biggest difficult it is with the final third, even with 3 strikers i cant have consistency in the number of goals

[bb]

2 hours ago, BatiGoal said:

Welcome, there's more time at home these days so more time for lengthy posts. To add about the Fast option, I think it's directly linked to players' Decisions more than anything else. You can afford to play this "risky" way with many good decision makers in the team, but low numbers here and it's probably best to turn it down a notch and give them more thinking time on the ball. 

Can't wait to see how the full formation looks like and run tests on it

[BatiGoal]

On 11/04/2020 at 02:14, Hugofernando said:

i cant score 130 goals+ even in weak leagues, like league one(with PSG) 

Do you play beyond 5 seasons? Don't think I've ever scored 130+ in my first 2-3 seasons either tbh. Not sure as I've never kept track but I think it's not very common. My advice is go for 100gls or so and aim for 130+ once you're 5-6 seasons in, have built a worldclass squad and the game's become a little easier to win big against. 

Edited April 12, 2020 by BatiGoal

[Hugofernando]

On 12/04/2020 at 01:38, BatiGoal said:

Do you play beyond 5 seasons? Don't think I've ever scored 130+ in my first 2-3 seasons either tbh. Not sure as I've never kept track but I think it's not very common. My advice is go for 100gls or so and aim for 130+ once you're 5-6 seasons in, have built a worldclass squad and the game's become a little easier to win big against. 

I usually play for 2 or 3 seasons trying to find a good tactic but for an ultra offensive tactic I have problems the tactic starts well and then stops working

[bb]

On 10/04/2020 at 14:47, BatiGoal said:

If I share my views on all the types of tactics you mentioned in the OP I'll need another 4-5 hours. Instead I'll pick one every few days and share my thoughts on how I went (or would go) about it. In this particular one, the possession based tactic, I spent 3-4 days last week trying to perfect the playing style needed to end each game with the highest possession % possible. An attempt to break the then record that stood on 80% but primarily just as a challenge for myself. After many games and tweaks I ended up with a formation that generated a pretty high average % vs strong teams approx 60-65%, vs mid-table teams 65-70% and vs the weak 70-75%. It peaked at 81% which just barely broke the record. But it's a one off. 

Here's the end result with a few answers:

First off, if you want to play possession football and dominate every opponent you'll need solid players. I can win games with weak players when needed, well if things go my way, but to dominate much stronger AI is virtually impossible so you'll need to pick decent/good players for the positions above. What attracted me about possession football is that it's more time on the ball for me and less for the opponent. It comes at a price tho, sort of, all that possession is needed to find and exploit chinks in the armor. This takes time and often results in fewer chances than your regular tactic, but in general there's fewer needed as we become more efficient. I love my "create 20 chances and score 6-7gls" as well, but this is just a different type of football for the fans. On the 2-5-3 formation:

After many tests I found that going with a flat 5 gives the highest average. Sometimes opting for a reversed 3-5-2 which works very well too but the key by far is the 5 in midfield. It did better in terms of possession % than any triangles or diamonds I experimented with. 

CDs - just solid defenders that pass the ball to the next guy. Two is enough if they're great. Not so great then try going with 3 at the back. 

WMs - reliable wide men that play without many risks of losing the ball. Fewer chances than your traditional Winger but better possession wise. And since there's no FBs, this or DWs makes better sense. 

CMs - as simple as they come. Link both ends without trying anything funny. Most other roles are risky in one way or another so these are, again, the perfect roles to keep possession of the ball. 

BWM - in order to keep my % as high as possible I needed a "thief" in my team in case one of my players lost the ball, so hence his inclusion. Everytime an opponent touches the ball our % drops, so we need a top BWM right in the middle. 

TM - strong physical lad to keep and hold the ball so the rest of the team has time to move forward and/or reorganize. Any player(role) who holds off opponents should make the team if you're thinking of playing possession football imo. 

IFs - I wanted to keep play wide up front, to create space in the box, and at the same time provide enough firepower to convert the few chances we create. IFs seemed perfect for the job. I tried DFs and DLFs but not as effective. Disappointing tbh as I initially had high hopes for the two roles. 

 

There's a few more thoughts behind my decisions that led to this formation as it was a lot of trial and error (lots of error 😂 etc etc) but in short this was the thinking process over that period of time. Any questions feel free to ask. 

Any update yet?

[BatiGoal]

On 11/04/2020 at 02:38, bb said:

Can't wait to see how the full formation looks like and run tests on it

Let me know how it goes possession wise.

2-5-3

Spoiler

 

[KUMAN1]

On 10.04.2020 г. at 16:47, BatiGoal said:

Ако споделя мнението си за всички видове тактики, които споменахте в ОП, ще ми трябват още 4-5 часа. Вместо това ще избирам по един на всеки няколко дни и ще споделя мислите си за това как отидох (или бих отишла) по въпроса. В тази конкретна, тактиката, основана на притежанието, прекарах 3-4 дни миналата седмица, опитвайки се да усъвършенствам стила на игра, необходим за завършване на всяка игра с възможно най-високото притежание%. Опит за счупване на тогавашния рекорд, който беше на 80%, но преди всичко само като предизвикателство за мен. След много игри и ощипвания завърших с формация, която генерира доста висок среден% срещу силни отбори приблизително 60-65%, срещу отбори от средната маса 65-70% и срещу слабите 70-75%. То достигна 81%, което едва не счупи рекорда. Но това е еднократно. 

Ето крайния резултат с няколко

On 10.04.2020 г. at 16:47, BatiGoal said:

Ако споделя мнението си за всички видове тактики, които споменахте в ОП, ще ми трябват още 4-5 часа. Вместо това ще избирам по един на всеки няколко дни и ще споделя мислите си за това как отидох (или бих отишла) по въпроса. В тази конкретна, тактиката, основана на притежанието, прекарах 3-4 дни миналата седмица, опитвайки се да усъвършенствам стила на игра, необходим за завършване на всяка игра с възможно най-високото притежание%. Опит за счупване на тогавашния рекорд, който беше на 80%, но преди всичко само като предизвикателство за мен. След много игри и ощипвания завърших с формация, която генерира доста висок среден% срещу силни отбори приблизително 60-65%, срещу отбори от средната маса 65-70% и срещу слабите 70-75%. То достигна 81%, което едва не счупи рекорда. Но това е еднократно. 

Ето крайния резултат с няколко отговора:

Първо, ако искате да играете владеещ футбол и да доминирате над всеки опонент ще са ви нужни солидни играчи. Мога да печеля игри със слаби играчи, когато е необходимо, добре, ако нещата вървят по моя път, но да доминирам много по-силен AI е практически невъзможно, така че ще трябва да изберете прилични / добри играчи за позициите по-горе. Това, което ме привлече при притежанието на футбола, е, че е повече време за топката за мен и по-малко за противника. Той идва на цена, нещо като цялото притежание, необходимо за намиране и експлоатация на парчета в бронята. Това отнема време и често води до по-малко шансове от редовната ви тактика, но като цяло има по-малко нужда, тъй като ставаме по-ефективни. Обичам също така „създавам 20 шанса и вкарвам 6-7 грама“, но това е просто различен тип футбол за феновете. Относно формацията 2-5-3:

След много тестове установих, че отиването с плосък 5 дава най-високата средна стойност. Понякога се избира за обърната 3-5-2, която също работи много добре, но ключът към момента е 5-та в средата. Той се справи по-добре по отношение на притежанието% от всички триъгълници или диаманти, с които експериментирах. 

CD - просто солидни защитници, които предават топката на следващия човек. Две са достатъчни, ако са страхотни. Не е толкова страхотно, след това опитайте да отидете с 3 отзад. 

WMs - надеждни широки мъже, които играят без много рискове от загуба на топката. По-малко шансове от традиционния ви Уингър, но по-добре притежаващ. И тъй като няма FBs, това или DW има по-добър смисъл. 

СМ - толкова прости, колкото идват. Свържете двата края, без да опитвате нещо смешно. Повечето други роли са рисковани по един или друг начин, така че това отново са перфектните роли за запазване на притежанието на топката. 

BWM - за да поддържам процента си възможно най-висок, се нуждаех от „крадец“ в моя отбор, в случай че някой от играчите ми загуби топката, така че и включването му. Всеки път, когато противник докосне топката, нашите% пада, така че имаме нужда от топ BWM точно в средата. 

TM - силен физически момък, който да държи и държи топката, така че останалата част от отбора има време да се придвижи напред и / или да се реорганизира. Всеки играч (роля), който държи на противници, трябва да направи отбора, ако мислите да играете притежание футбол imo. 

АКО - Исках да продължа да играя широко отпред, да създам пространство в кутията и в същото време да осигуря достатъчно огнева сила, за да преобразуваме няколкото шанса, които създаваме. АКО изглеждаха идеални за работата. Опитах DFs и DLFs, но не толкова ефективни. Разочароващо tbh, тъй като първоначално имах големи надежди за двете роли. 

 

Има още няколко мисли зад моите решения, които доведоха до това формиране, тъй като бяха много опити и грешки (много грешки 😂 и т.н. и т.н.), но накратко това беше процесът на мислене през този период от време. Всякакви въпроси можете да задавате. 

What defence and attack movement use?

отговора:

Първо, ако искате да играете владеещ футбол и да доминирате над всеки опонент ще са ви нужни солидни играчи. Мога да печеля игри със слаби играчи, когато е необходимо, добре, ако нещата вървят по моя път, но да доминирам много по-силен AI е практически невъзможно, така че ще трябва да изберете прилични / добри играчи за позициите по-горе. Това, което ме привлече при притежанието на футбола, е, че е повече време за топката за мен и по-малко за противника. Той идва на цена, нещо като цялото притежание, необходимо за намиране и експлоатация на парчета в бронята. Това отнема време и често води до по-малко шансове от редовната ви тактика, но като цяло има по-малко нужда, тъй като ставаме по-ефективни. Обичам също така „създавам 20 шанса и вкарвам 6-7 грама“, но това е просто различен тип футбол за феновете. Относно формацията 2-5-3:

След много тестове установих, че отиването с плосък 5 дава най-високата средна стойност. Понякога се избира за обърната 3-5-2, която също работи много добре, но ключът към момента е 5-та в средата. Той се справи по-добре по отношение на притежанието% от всички триъгълници или диаманти, с които експериментирах. 

CD - просто солидни защитници, които предават топката на следващия човек. Две са достатъчни, ако са страхотни. Не е толкова страхотно, след това опитайте да отидете с 3 отзад. 

WMs - надеждни широки мъже, които играят без много рискове от загуба на топката. По-малко шансове от традиционния ви Уингър, но по-добре притежаващ. И тъй като няма FBs, това или DW има по-добър смисъл. 

СМ - толкова прости, колкото идват. Свържете двата края, без да опитвате нещо смешно. Повечето други роли са рисковани по един или друг начин, така че това отново са перфектните роли за запазване на притежанието на топката. 

BWM - за да поддържам процента си възможно най-висок, се нуждаех от „крадец“ в моя отбор, в случай че някой от играчите ми загуби топката, така че и включването му. Всеки път, когато противник докосне топката, нашите% пада, така че имаме нужда от топ BWM точно в средата. 

TM - силен физически момък, който да държи и държи топката, така че останалата част от отбора има време да се придвижи напред и / или да се реорганизира. Всеки играч (роля), който държи на противници, трябва да направи отбора, ако мислите да играете притежание футбол imo. 

АКО - Исках да продължа да играя широко отпред, да създам пространство в кутията и в същото време да осигуря достатъчно огнева сила, за да преобразуваме няколкото шанса, които създаваме. АКО изглеждаха идеални за работата. Опитах DFs и DLFs, но не толкова ефективни. Разочароващо tbh, тъй като първоначално имах големи надежди за двете роли. 

 

Има още няколко мисли зад моите решения, които доведоха до това формиране, тъй като бяха много опити и грешки (много грешки 😂 и т.н. и т.н.), но накратко това беше процесът на мислене през този период от време. Всякакви въпроси можете да задавате.