Chat Why the players in B-team don't develop??

[Nick11]

When you put youth players in your reserve team they do grow their stats but if you demote players to B/2nd team, even when they play, their stats simply don't grow irrespective of the training facility of team. Same thing happens when you loan out a player from b-team or demote a player after loaning him out. ( Even if i sim the game for a season or two, they don't grow).

Does anyone have any kind of idea why this thing happens?

[Rich]

It’s so frustrating, basically your B teams haven’t got the same facilities that your first team have, I try and keep my best youngsters in my first team when I play in Italy or Spain and loan them out, that way they get better. But it’s ridiculous that when you upgrade your facilities it doesn’t affect your B team 👎🏻

[Nick11]

16 minutes ago, RichD said:

It’s so frustrating, basically your B teams haven’t got the same facilities that your first team have, I try and keep my best youngsters in my first team when I play in Italy or Spain and loan them out, that way they get better. But it’s ridiculous that when you upgrade your facilities it doesn’t affect your B team 👎🏻

Tried it with top tier clubs, didn't work. What's the benefit of having it when they don't develop even after playing games. This is one of the main reason i haven't Managed Bundesliga(Except Frankfurt, RBL & Leverkusen) and LaLiga teams. I mainly play for youth development and having entire team of academy youths 😕.

[Rich]

1 minute ago, Nick11 said:

Tried it with top tier clubs, didn't work. What's the benefit of having it when they don't develop even after playing games. This is one of the main reason i haven't Managed Bundesliga(Except Frankfurt, RBL & Leverkusen) and LaLiga teams. I mainly play for youth development and having entire team of academy youths 😕.

It’s worked for me in my game with Atletico where some of my youth youngsters became the best players on the game from keeping them in my first team and loaning out. I agree I like brining youth through, it’s frustrating.

[Alfredo88]

I’m assuming that you guys haven’t found this to be a problem in England, right? My Chelsea reserves develop a lot.

[Rich]

1 minute ago, Alfredo88 said:

I’m assuming that you guys haven’t found this to be a problem in England, right? My Chelsea reserves develop a lot.

Yeah England is fine, the facilities are from reserves are the same as the first team, same goes for places like Scotland😁

[Alfredo88]

1 hour ago, RichD said:

Yeah England is fine, the facilities are from reserves are the same as the first team, same goes for places like Scotland😁

Ok cool. I thought youth facilities were for the reserves but those must be for your academy then, I suppose?

[Rich]

Just now, Alfredo88 said:

Ok cool. I thought youth facilities were for the reserves but those must be for your academy then, I suppose?

Yeah I guess because some countries, the B teams actually play in the leagues and can get promoted and relegated so are seen as there own club, which is silly really.

[Scratch]

Yeah, there are two separate systems: Reserves and Second Teams (sometime called B Teams). You can tell which one you have from the word used in the menu to get to the squad. 

There are lots of things Reserves can do that Second Teams can't... Eg: Second Teams don't show a message when you offer a player out, they don't show the attribute improvement icons, you get players complaining about coaches and facilities when there's no way to see them or upgrade them, etc etc. I've reported a lot of them over on the SI Games site (as have others) and also suggested they should overhaul Second Teams to make them as close to Reserves as possible, so hopefully they will sort it out sooner or later, but might take them a while...

[Scratch]

Actually Marc Vaughan said this yesterday over on the SI Games forum:

Quote

 

In FMM21 they should share your staff and facilities now (if there are any instances when they don't let me know - they do play at a seperate stadium obviously but the rest should be the same), but there are obviously still things to improve, I expect most of the remaining issues will be to do with player motivation during matches - at present it operates in the same way as the reserve team, older (or more established) players will only put in partial effort according to their personalities and may be frankly much reduced in performance if they're lazy and/or trying to avoid injury.

I'm especially interested in investigating any training issues you might be seeing and I'll start a save tonight to try and look into it myself, but if you have a save exhibiting things that I could look at then it would speed things up 

 

Might be worth sending them your save and some more details so they can investigate it.

Edited January 20, 2021 by Scratch

[Pharel]

You can speed up potential training by motivational coach, but its capped by what league you playing at, the best practice is loan them to the other club that guaranteed them playtime.

You wont ever heard such a legendary strikers were born simply by playing in reserves league isnt it?

The real concern is the exp system (player rating) strangled people to even reach their full potential.

Thumbs down for that

Edited January 20, 2021 by Pharel

[Nick11]

On 20/01/2021 at 09:50, Scratch said:

Yeah, there are two separate systems: Reserves and Second Teams (sometime called B Teams). You can tell which one you have from the word used in the menu to get to the squad. 

There are lots of things Reserves can do that Second Teams can't... Eg: Second Teams don't show a message when you offer a player out, they don't show the attribute improvement icons, you get players complaining about coaches and facilities when there's no way to see them or upgrade them, etc etc. I've reported a lot of them over on the SI Games site (as have others) and also suggested they should overhaul Second Teams to make them as close to Reserves as possible, so hopefully they will sort it out sooner or later, but might take them a while...

Or they can make 2nd team as they were in earlier versions. Everything that you said used to happen back then. Payer development wasn't even an issue, i could happly demote players to B-team until they were mature enough for 1st team.

Is it true that we can't upgrade their facility??

I think this issue of players not devloping attributes is down to the facts that their playing level is way below than level they should be playing at ( based on their Current ability)

[Nick11]

23 hours ago, Pharel said:

You can speed up potential training by motivational coach, but its capped by what league you playing at, the best practice is loan them to the other club that guaranteed them playtime.

You wont ever heard such a legendary strikers were born simply by playing in reserves league isnt it?

The real concern is the exp system (player rating) strangled people to even reach their full potential.

Thumbs down for that

Yeah they don't develop in reserve but ur legendary striker to play for reserve when they are 15/16/17 before being promoted or sent on loan. Were talking about issue of attributes not devloping even when we loan a b-team player. Any idea ??

[Et Rakuti]

5 hours ago, Nick11 said:

Yeah they don't develop in reserve but ur legendary striker to play for reserve when they are 15/16/17 before being promoted or sent on loan. Were talking about issue of attributes not devloping even when we loan a b-team player. Any idea ??

Interesting, first team and reserves one have different growth cap level indeed.

Its already like that from fm 2020.

Same as people who declining due his age tends to freeze their stats when being moved to the reserves , thats from my experience in spain, italy and england.

 

And for your problem about stat not growth even you loaning your player, i dont have that problem. I have 60 player in the team with a lot of them being loaned to the other club. Try to fit the club with your player capability or it wont grow because they didnt use "him" in the match.

For example: Its obivious theres club with legendary goalkeeper, wants to loan our weak GK even they have about 5 of it. In the end our players not even used till the end of the seasons.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Et Rakuti

[DIRECTFX]

Now what about affiliated clubs ? Is there better growth there ? Haven’t used affiliate club as usually start lower leagues. Is there a separate growth system for affiliate, reserve and B clubs? Wondering if you guys had reserve club and an affiliate which develops players better ? 
There was an update on IOS for FFM anyone know if it had anything to do with this topic , as Marc quote seemed to be that it was fixed and was thinking of what to fix next not the normal we put it on list to look at and should be fixed in future response. 

[broodje kip]

2 hours ago, DIRECTFX said:

Now what about affiliated clubs ? Is there better growth there ? Haven’t used affiliate club as usually start lower leagues. Is there a separate growth system for affiliate, reserve and B clubs? Wondering if you guys had reserve club and an affiliate which develops players better ? 
There was an update on IOS for FFM anyone know if it had anything to do with this topic , as Marc quote seemed to be that it was fixed and was thinking of what to fix next not the normal we put it on list to look at and should be fixed in future response. 

Affiliates work better. I’d say loaning generally works better than staying in reserves or B team

[Scratch]

10 minutes ago, broodje kip said:

Affiliates work better. I’d say loaning generally works better than staying in reserves or B team

I often leave them in the Reserves (not B-Team) for a while, as I find they level up fairly well there and I can keep retraining them in different positions and swapping around their target attribute.

When all that's pretty much set, then i will loan them out. To the affiliate if need be, but if I can get them playing at a higher level even better. 

[Mr Tree]

The only benefit I've found with the affiliate so far is that it's easier to loan the player out - you basically assign them to play there (although they can reject it). The downside to that though is that the affiliate won't pay the player's wages. I have found too that the affiliate clubs usually offer to take your Listed for Loan players (and then they'll pay, although not always). But I'm actually just experiencing them for the first time, 20 seasons in, as bizarrely Northampton Town had 3 affiliates when i arrived. I wonder if they start with them... Too lazy to find out, i assume they do...

Otherwise i definitely prefer Reserves to B team, found out about the flaws with that system when i did a challenge in Russia with Spartak Moscow, so i avoid B teams now. I'm happy enough elsewhere but it's a bit of a shame, hopefully it's getting fixed...

I tend to only keep 12-14 players in my first team squad, using "Promote for Next Match" to fill the bench and ensuring that backups are playing regularly etc. I think it's good for development - it feels like it, and my bees youth save went well last year, even though i was doing sub-standard training (lesson learned for this year thanks to @broodje kip!). Sometimes i get caught out cos i don't pay attention to fixtures, so players I'd want to fill in the first team have got knackered playing for the Reserves the day before, but that's easily fixed if you pay attention. 

I generally loan out as much as i can, it's hit or miss but some players do improve significantly on a loan spell. Plus you can call them back anytime, if you get caught short with an injury etc. I've written about it elsewhere but loans are very exploitable - you can fill your squad with free loans to give you the depth you need, allowing your young players to go out on loan and develop well. 

[MoMoses]

In the Editor there is the option to let your B-team players train at the facilities of the A-squad. I just checked..Barcelona and Real Madrid have B-teams but the option to let these B-players train at the mother team's facilities is checked out in the editor. Maybe this would solve these problems?

I also checked Dortmund and this team lets their B-players train at the club's facilities but I believe Dortmund II plays in a non-playable league, so this won't do the development of the players any good either.

I will try a game with the mentioned option enabled. I'll let you guys know if it worked

[DIRECTFX]

Just recently did a Dortmund save found that out hard way the Dortmund 2 team is in the 4th division but have zero fixtures only played games if I scheduled a bunch of friendlies. Just confusing as they mad 2 Reserve Groups with other teams and Bayern 2 is in 3 division seems it’s very messed up as Dortmund 2 should be placed in the two reserve groups or just given some random schedule instead of stuck in here’s the team but we play zero games making it totally worthless option besides extra roster spots. Maybe even just bump em to same division as Bayern 2? 
 

Just wonder if anyone tried filling a team like Dortmund 2 fixtures list with a bunch of games say around same number as division it’s in , will the players progress as they play same amount of games ? Or does computer kinda discount friendlies you schedule for development? If I play in a league with working reserves and see they have a big break before their season starts I usually manually put in friendlies just so they aren’t sitting around just know thinking if it’s even worth it if games count could be a way to add extra development thru game time if it does ?