Tactics 4-2-3-1 tactic, over 60-70% possession.

[O'zed]

I've been trying to create a good tactic for high loads of possession, passes and goals. I've studied Pep from Barca , Bayern and City and I've been obsessed with the play those teams have exhibited, so I tried creating mine. Here are the roles:

GK - SK 

LB & RB - WB 

CB - BPD & CD 

CM - CM & DLP 

AML & AMR - AP 

AMC - AP 

ST - PF 

PS: The AML should be right footed, while the AMR should be left footed. 

 

Enjoy!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Uncleseekx]

Show the league ending results. Doubt it will produce goals 

[O'zed]

I'm not done with the league, but I'm top with 3 games to go

[Uncleseekx]

3 hours ago, O'zed said:

I'm not done with the league, but I'm top with 3 games to go

Post results when you're done 👍

[Schwantz34]

Three AP's in a line together is an interesting setup that you don't often see.

[DanEnglish]

Three APs in a line? Agree this is unusual. So I’ve been testing it with my Man Utd save (austerity + asset stripping)…

Spoiler - it does have GREAT possession, we’d be more effective with a strong aerial ST (not Martial!), but the opposition rips us apart down the center.

Some suggested tweaks at the bottom! Will continue testing it.

——————————————
Test #1
vs Wolves’ 5221
——————————————

We would expect:

1. our main passing option from the back is our WBs - who will have time + space,
2. the opposition’s four MC/AMC to have a lot of time + space,
3. for us to get ripped apart in the gap centrally between our two DCs + two MCs.

Plus as the opposition are playing a BWM in their MRC position (who will drop deep + centrally when defending):

• our CM / MLC (Fred) should have more time + space on the ball. Pity our Fred isn’t a B2B - which would take advantage of this!

Can we see any of this in the match stats?!

Spoiler

We have fantastic possession: 64%! Plus it looks great.

BUT they are ripping us apart. 3 shots + 2 clear cut chances (inc. the disallowed goal) and are 1-0 up.

We had lots of lower quality chances, and mostly unsuccessful crosses / corners. That’s why a more aerially strong ST would be better.

Their two AMCs + lone ST are ripping us apart. Each has 2-3 key passes, plus each has 1 shot on target (inc. the disallowed goal).

Possession - our high possession stats is mostly with our four defenders, plus our unmarked CM / MLC (Fred) as predicted before.

Interestingly our AMC / AP (Pereira) is also getting a decent amount of passes, but doing nothing with them.

Key Passes:

• Are coming from our unmarked MLC (Fred) - who we should really change to a B2B…
• … plus our lone ST (Martial) - who is feeding the APs as a creator - perhaps should pick a more creative ST (to provide better passes) or change the role to an AF / Poacher (to receive more through balls). 
   

Key Highlights:
Playing Out to the Wingbacks

Spoiler

Lots of examples of this - as our WBs are unmarked by the opposition 5221. 

… even though other players are marked, our WBs are an easy passing option for our DCs.

Key Highlights:
Your ST is a key creator (but of lower quality chances)

Spoiler

While I saw multiple examples - here is one WHOLE move …

Who should our MLC pass to … ? …

… it goes to our AMC / AP, then onto our lone ST, who has drifted a little wider …

This shows the lack of movement:

• Our DLP could run forward into space like a B2B, but doesn’t.
• Our AMR / AP could run into space / behind the defense like an IW / IF, but doesn’t.
• Thankfully our AML / AP does run forward into space (white line)

Though it’s only a half-chance, and isn’t scored. 
 

 
Key Highlights:
They rip us apart down the middle.

Spoiler

Here is their disallowed goal … there’s a big gap between our MCs and between our DCs ..

… an opposition AMC is unmarked + our DC pushes up to close him down … leaving space for their lone ST to receive the ball unmarked + put it into the net.

This was their goal … again a HUGE gap between our two DCs, and between our two MCs …

… one through ball down the center and their Shasiw Striker has a clear cut chance.

I’d suggest either playing narrow, or even better playing with a DMC (Anchor) and two MCs (CM + B2B/AP) against this type of formation.

Overall

I love this setup - 3 APs is quite unique, the possession stats are brilliant + the passing moves lookgreat to watch.

Vs an opposition 5221, I recommend:

• a better aerial ST (Ronaldo?) or a better ST role (AF?) …
• plus using a B2B if the opposition play a BWM (and no oppositionDMC) …
• plus switch our formation to a DMC with 2 MCs against this type of opposition formation 

Thoughts?! 🙂 

Edited June 28, 2022 by DanEnglish

[Uncleseekx]

51 minutes ago, DanEnglish said:

Three APs in a line? Agree this is unusual. So I’ve been testing it with my Man Utd save (austerity + asset stripping)…

Spoiler - it does have GREAT possession, we’d be more effective with a strong aerial ST (not Martial!), but the opposition rips us apart down the center.

Some suggested tweaks at the bottom! Will continue testing it.

——————————————
Test #1
vs Wolves’ 5221
——————————————

We would expect:

1. our main passing option from the back is our WBs - who will have time + space,
2. the opposition’s four MC/AMC to have a lot of time + space,
3. for us to get ripped apart in the gap centrally between our two DCs + two MCs.

Plus as the opposition are playing a BWM in their MRC position (who will drop deep + centrally when defending):

• our CM / MLC (Fred) should have more time + space on the ball. Pity our Fred isn’t a B2B - which would take advantage of this!

Can we see any of this in the match stats?!

  Hide contents

We have fantastic possession: 64%! Plus it looks great.

BUT they are ripping us apart. 3 shots + 2 clear cut chances (inc. the disallowed goal) and are 1-0 up.

We had lots of lower quality chances, and mostly unsuccessful crosses / corners. That’s why a more aerially strong ST would be better.

Their two AMCs + lone ST are ripping us apart. Each has 2-3 key passes, plus each has 1 shot on target (inc. the disallowed goal).

Possession - our high possession stats is mostly with our four defenders, plus our unmarked CM / MLC (Fred) as predicted before.

Interestingly our AMC / AP (Pereira) is also getting a decent amount of passes, but doing nothing with them.

Key Passes:

• Are coming from our unmarked MLC (Fred) - who we should really change to a B2B…
• … plus our lone ST (Martial) - who is feeding the APs as a creator - perhaps should pick a more creative ST (to provide better passes) or change the role to an AF / Poacher (to receive more through balls). 
   

Key Highlights:
Playing Out to the Wingbacks

  Reveal hidden contents

Lots of examples of this - as our WBs are unmarked by the opposition 5221. 

… even though other players are marked, our WBs are an easy passing option for our DCs.

Key Highlights:
Your ST is a key creator (but of lower quality chances)

  Hide contents

While I saw multiple examples - here is one WHOLE move …

Who should our MLC pass to … ? …

… it goes to our AMC / AP, then onto our lone ST, who has drifted a little wider …

This shows the lack of movement:

• Our DLP could run forward into space like a B2B, but doesn’t.
• Our AMR / AP could run into space / behind the defense like an IW / IF, but doesn’t.
• Thankfully our AML / AP does run forward into space (white line)

Though it’s only a half-chance, and isn’t scored. 
 

 
Key Highlights:
They rip us apart down the middle.

  Reveal hidden contents

Here is their disallowed goal … there’s a big gap between our MCs and between our DCs ..

… an opposition AMC is unmarked + our DC pushes up to close him down … leaving space for their lone ST to receive the ball unmarked + put it into the net.

This was their goal … again a HUGE gap between our two DCs, and between our two MCs …

… one through ball down the center and their Shasiw Striker has a clear cut chance.

I’d suggest either playing narrow, or even better playing with a DMC (Anchor) and two MCs (CM + B2B/AP) against this type of formation.

Overall

I love this setup - 3 APs is quite unique, the possession stats are brilliant + the passing moves lookgreat to watch.

Vs an opposition 5221, I recommend:

• a better aerial ST (Ronaldo?) or a better ST role (AF?) …
• plus using a B2B if the opposition play a BWM (and no oppositionDMC) …
• plus switch our formation to a DMC with 2 MCs against this type of opposition formation 

Thoughts?! 🙂 

That wolves match shows I'm having secund thoughts in trying out the formation. Won't produce goals that much. Have tried three AP's and inverted wingers, the best money could buy for a possible 1kc for Haaland and they couldn't create anything 

[DanEnglish]

5 hours ago, Uncleseekx said:

That wolves match shows I'm having secund thoughts in trying out the formation. 

To be fair:

1. I really struggle to find any formation that does well against an opposition back three (51221, 5221, 5212)…
2. … and the passing movement of this tactic is really good to look at - any tweak I’ve made so far improves the defensive solidity but ruins the passing!

Kudos to the OP 👍 

[Schwantz34]

3 hours ago, DanEnglish said:

To be fair:

1. I really struggle to find any formation that does well against an opposition back three (51221, 5221, 5212)…
2. … and the passing movement of this tactic is really good to look at - any tweak I’ve made so far improves the defensive solidity but ruins the passing!

Kudos to the OP 👍 

Wonder if you can win trophies with it? I'd be happy with the odd cup win on some of my saves 😂

Will give it a go somewhere good but not great and see how it does. Maybe the trusty go to with Wolfsburg.

[Uncleseekx]

1 hour ago, Schwantz34 said:

Wonder if you can win trophies with it? I'd be happy with the odd cup win on some of my saves 😂

Will give it a go somewhere good but not great and see how it does. Maybe the trusty go to with Wolfsburg.

Waiting for his league results before I test it out. Don't want to waste time on it just to find out it won't do well

[Uncleseekx]

Quick question though, the instructions says look for overlap, will the wingbacks still look to deliver crosses? I always use hit early crosses or leave it blank 

[LFCTERAS]

What roles you train the players ?

[Schwantz34]

49 minutes ago, LFCTERAS said:

What roles you train the players ?

You're asking this in every tactic thread.

The best way is to train the players for the roles listed in the tactic.

[LFCTERAS]

Ok, and you choose the pkayers for best players use curent abillity ? Or wich is best way to choose best players from my team ?

[Schwantz34]

2 hours ago, LFCTERAS said:

Ok, and you choose the pkayers for best players use curent abillity ? Or wich is best way to choose best players from my team ?

That all depends on whether you want to improve your younger players faster by giving them games, or just use established players.

Personally I like to see how good three or four of the younger players can become. For example when I play as Leeds I make sure to give plenty of game time to players like Cresswell, Bate, Hjelde, Greenwood, Struijk, McKinstry and others.

Some people prefer to just used established players or buy in big stars, while others prefer a mixture. Really does all depend on how you want to play the game.

Training wise though I would always try to train your players to the roles they will be playing in, or bring in players that can, if you find your players can't manage the roles you're asking them to play.

 

Edited June 28, 2022 by Schwantz34

[DanEnglish]

8 hours ago, Uncleseekx said:

Quick question though, the instructions says look for overlap, will the wingbacks still look to deliver crosses? I always use hit early crosses or leave it blank 

Great question. In the Man Utd vs Wolves example above = not really. Our WBR had zero crosses, and our WBL attempted 3 crosses (but they could have all been corners) - despite them both being on the ball A LOT vs Wolves narrow formation.

The players match stats from the Original Poster also suggests “not many crosses from the WBs - except crosses from free kicks / corners” but I could be wrong.

Does this make sense?

[Uncleseekx]

2 hours ago, DanEnglish said:

Great question. In the Man Utd vs Wolves example above = not really. Our WBR had zero crosses, and our WBL attempted 3 crosses (but they could have all been corners) - despite them both being on the ball A LOT vs Wolves narrow formation.

The players match stats from the Original Poster also suggests “not many crosses from the WBs - except crosses from free kicks / corners” but I could be wrong.

Does this make sense?

I understand you. I later tried it out. The wingbacks made crosses despite looking for overlaps

[O'zed]

On 28/06/2022 at 11:33, DanEnglish said:

To be fair:

1. I really struggle to find any formation that does well against an opposition back three (51221, 5221, 5212)…
2. … and the passing movement of this tactic is really good to look at - any tweak I’ve made so far improves the defensive solidity but ruins the passing!

Kudos to the OP 👍 

Thanks, please I know you've been in the business of making tactics 😁, I'm still new to this 

Could you please try doing a Pep Barca recreation and please explain the final third instructions, does run at defence mean the whole team or only the midfielders

[O'zed]

On 26/06/2022 at 20:19, Uncleseekx said:

Show the league ending results. Doubt it will produce goals 

I ran some months in holiday mode

[Uncleseekx]

1 hour ago, O'zed said:

I ran some months in holiday mode

Looks decent. Gave up on it cause it wasn't really producing goals. Teams with good center backs or near good center backs were pocketing my striker and with the setup when the Forward is closed, no other goal scoring threat. And in defense the huge gap between the midfield line and the center backs is really exploited by teams hence a formation with a DM is really key in the game. Really loved the possession but the goals were no where to be found 

[Schwantz34]

1 hour ago, O'zed said:

I ran some months in holiday mode

Holiday mode doesn't use your tactic so it's useless as a test.

[O'zed]

9 hours ago, Schwantz34 said:

Holiday mode doesn't use your tactic so it's useless as a test.

Okay, I'll run it normally