Tactics Conte 343/352 Hybrid system

[hhooo]

I've been away for a while. A new kid and a job hunt have been the main culprits. 

Quite a while ago, I commented on another Conte-inspired tactic that it didn't play like his teams, despite being the right shape on paper. 

Designing a tactic that both played like a Conte team, and was actually good enough to be enjoyable took a long while. But I've found it, and it's by far my favorite tactic that I've used this year. Let's take a look. 

 

Shape & Instructions

Spoiler

I had been using something similar to this for a long time, but it wasn't good defensively. The breakthroughs have been using an Anchor instead of a DM/DLP, and using 4x IWBs instead of 2 WB/2 IWB. 

The one concession I make here to functionality over stylistic accuracy is inverted footing on the attacking IWBs, as you can see above. This is for a two reasons:

 - Outswinging crosses aren't actually effective without a huge target man striker, and Spurs don't have that.  Inswinging crosses are much more effective for smaller players with good movement. 

 - It really improves ball retention from goal kicks. The advanced IWB is usually the first pass from the GK. If you have aligned footedness, the next pass is often an aimless ball into the channel. If you invert, however, the next pass will either be backwards to another defender or the GK, or they will turn and run with the ball until they can find a pass to either the BBM or RP. This can replicate the fast, direct attacks that are characteristic of Conte's Inter and Spurs. 

 

Player roles and positioning options (Everyone needs Decisions, I'm not going to specifically call that out)

Your Sweeper will be on the ball less, but will be making lots of interceptions. Aerial, Strength, Positioning, Tackling, and Technique are good here. Pace is obviously good, but often the Anchor will make the covering run if the Sweeper goes in for a challenge. The Sweeper will also run backwards toward goal in order to make an angle for a clearance or pass, which is where technique (and two-footedness) becomes important.

The defensive IWBs are basically where your traditional BPDs will play. Pace, Passing, Positioning, Tackling Technique, Movement, and Creativity are all good here. They will form a line of three with your Anchor, in front of the Sweeper, and will pick up on tons of clearances to recycle possession. They will be on the ball often, and will probably make the most passes on the team. They won't be defending in the air often, but will be in foot races with wingers. These players should be set to Man Mark to help bring them in tighter to the Sweeper. 

The Anchor will work functionally in a team with the Sweeper, and they will make covering runs for each other to pick up second balls after one makes an aerial challenge. Tackling, Positioning, Strength, and  Passing are the key attributes, with Aerial and Pace being bonuses. 

The attacking IWBs are where your traditional attacking WBs will go. Having a defensive and an attacking option on each side is a good idea. Besides the traditional WB stuff, Passing, Technique, and Creativity are important. They will be looking for your midfielders or IF to progress the ball or put in an inswinger. 

The BBM will take up the position between the two IWBs during buildup, and then make runs diagonally into the box, or down the half space, depending on footedness. Normal BBM attributes plus creativity and shooting are great. Crossing can even be useful here if you have a left footer on the left/right on right.

The RP will also move diagonally, moving from central areas into whichever half space is vacant. Defensive attributes are a bonus, but not necessary here. Strength, Stamina, and Technique are important, since this guy will be in the thick of things all match. 

The IF is a flexible role - you can place him anywhere along the AM line, but the consideration for placement should be defensive. When in possession, the IF (or SS if central) will have horizontal freedom of movement, so left/right/center doesn't matter. But you should try to position them on the same side as the most dangerous opposition winger - when out of possession, the two IWBs behind the IF will occupy the same space, doubling up on the winger. You can also position him centrally to press or mark a DLP if that is more important. Normal IF attributes apply - they will be running at the defense, getting on the end of through balls from the DLF, and shooting a ton. 

The DLF doesn't need to be a DLF, but it's clearly the best role for Kane in game. A fast AF or CF is also fine, but the DLF helped to recreate that classic Kane/Son interplay. 

 

For the tactic itself, the only in game changes I made were the positioning of the IF, moving from Control to Attacking if we needed a goal, or from High pressing to Balanced if we needed to save fitness for a quick turnaround match. You can change the BBM to a CM if you're defending a lead as well. 

 

First Season Results/Transfers

Spoiler

I always start Spurs with a budget, because you lose Romero and Kulusevski if you don't buy them before the second season. I did what I could to replicate the current squad, but replacements had to come in for Richarlison (too expensive) and Perisic (going to retire). My choices were CDK for another forward who can replicate what Kane brings as a DLF, and Nuno Santos as a creative attacker who is comfortable at wingback. GLC, Ndombelly, Regui, and Bergwijn all left, and Winks just rotted. (Kvaradonna was just out of curiosity, he had very little impact this season)

Spoiler

The best part of the season

Spoiler

 

Results were excellent for the prem first season, and I was honestly amazed at how good the defense was, since playing the same shape with a DM and 2WB/2IWB was extremely weak defensively. Two goals for and 0.6 against stayed consistent throughout the whole season. I played the same against big and small teams, home and away. Away against weaker teams we were susceptible to low-action parked buses, but most home games resulted in 18-24 shots for and 2-5 against. 

You can see the front 3 (DLF, IF, RP) take the lion's share of goals and shots, and the high involvement of the defensive IWBs gets them consistently high ratings. 

I'm going to run this first season with a few other teams, maybe Suwon in Korea or something in a lower league. If anyone has any requests for teams I should play a season with, drop them below. Would love to hear if this works for anyone else, but I realize most are waiting for the '23 drop now. Fingers crossed it'll still work!

 

 

Edited October 22, 2022 by hhooo

[hhooo]

And here are a few of the patterns that I was talking about above, for illustration purposes:

The RP playing in a front 3 - he will still press the fullback way beyond him, and will be high up the pitch in case of a turnover. 

Spoiler

 

Attacks built from goal kicks - just an example of the passing that occurs. IWB to RP or BBM, run with the ball until one of the forward makes a run, and play them through. More consistent with an AF, but this is my favorite thing about the tactic. 

Spoiler

 

In-possession formation and movement - the RP has come central again, the BBM is moving diagonally out to in, the attacking IWBs are still wide, and the IF/SS is central no matter where you position them. 

Spoiler

 

[StuartM]

Good to see you back and a really interesting system - far more interesting than any of mine!

[Schwantz34]

That looks like a crazy system and I love it! 

[hhooo]

8 hours ago, Schwantz34 said:

That looks like a crazy system and I love it! 

Thanks! I'm running a season with Forest Green now, and so far it translates really well to lower leagues. They have a big target man as well, so I'm playing around with IWB footedness again.

[Legend288]

Thnx. You make me to return to the game ) i will test it with man utd and post results

 

 

P.s i dont understand DLF needs aerial or not? 

 

 

 

Edited October 23, 2022 by Legend288

[hhooo]

28 minutes ago, Legend288 said:

Thnx. You make me to return to the game ) i will test it with man utd and post results

 

 

P.s i dont understand DLF needs aerial or not? 

 

 

 

DLF doesn't need Aerial. It helps, but not necessary. 

Pressing Forward can also work if someone has poor passing or decisions for example.

[Legend288]

16 minutes ago, hhooo said:

DLF doesn't need Aerial. It helps, but not necessary. 

Pressing Forward can also work if someone has poor passing or decisions for example.

I will do pressing forward becouse ronaldo cannot do well dlf )) 

[Legend288]

I cannot score goals (.  Maybe you have some advice? 

In game i have more or same shoots but cant score. If i did not have corner tactik i would be sucked.

Ronaldo and bruno have very good shooting . Bruno scored 2-3 with penalty )

 

[Schwantz34]

7 minutes ago, Legend288 said:

I cannot score goals (.  Maybe you have some advice? 

In game i have more or same shoots but cant score. If i did not have corner tactik i would be sucked.

Ronaldo and bruno have very good shooting . Bruno scored 2-3 with penalty )

 

Try the original tactic they posted and see if it's any better.

You altering it may have lessened the effectiveness of it.

[Legend288]

8 minutes ago, Schwantz34 said:

Try the original tactic they posted and see if it's any better.

You altering it may have lessened the effectiveness of it.

This is original . He said this does not matter Ss or IF. 

[hhooo]

18 minutes ago, Legend288 said:

This is original . He said this does not matter Ss or IF. 

I haven't used Ronaldo to know what role would suit him, but a PF might not be right for him. I would try Rashford or Martial, and then swap sides for the attacking IWBs. 

 

I'll try United later and see what happens.

[Schwantz34]

1 hour ago, Legend288 said:

This is original . He said this does not matter Ss or IF. 

I would still try the original way as IF and SS are very different roles, and you also have a different striker role?

Try Ronaldo as a CF. He's not really a PF in my opinion.

[hhooo]

8 hours ago, Legend288 said:

I cannot score goals (.  Maybe you have some advice? 

In game i have more or same shoots but cant score. If i did not have corner tactik i would be sucked.

Ronaldo and bruno have very good shooting . Bruno scored 2-3 with penalty )

 

So I started a save with United, no budgets, but did two player swaps to bring in Ramy Bensebaini and Danilo. Here's what I noticed/issues that may be confounding results:

 

Team Dynamics for United are bad - they have a terrible work rate. This makes any pressing tactic worse. A team with an 'A' rated work rate will likely just be better with this. 

Ronaldo doesn't really fit the tactic - he's not fast or hard working enough to be a PF, and isn't unselfish enough and good enough at passing to be a DLF. I do get some late goals with him as a sub as a Poacher. Cavani as a PF was a better fit, but what really blew the lid off and led to be me winning the last 6 matches in a row that I played was using Pogba as the DLF. Night and Day. 

For some reason, Telles, Shaw, and Dalot cross a lot more often than Spurs wingbacks, even when inverted. I turned off 'Early Crosses' and that helped the buildup.

Last thing, was United never got one of those attacks built straight from kickoff, like I have in the diagram above. This happened pretty frequently in the Spurs save, but United goes De Gea - Shaw - De Gea - lump it upfield (which is still okay with Pogba up front). I don't know how to fix this one yet. 

I hope that helps!

Edited October 24, 2022 by hhooo

[Legend288]

I need good striker and season 2 will be better. I want improve work rate too. 

[Legend288]

When i playing with SS  attacker is going left and SS going in centre like main CF. Becouse my cf cant score many goals and only SS is scoring.

 

Need to test with IF  . 

 

[hhooo]

3 hours ago, Legend288 said:

When i playing with SS  attacker is going left and SS going in centre like main CF. Becouse my cf cant score many goals and only SS is scoring.

 

Need to test with IF  . 

 

You can set it up like this if you want to get the SS left and DLF right

[Legend288]

I had to many shoots and little amount of goals. I turn on work in the box and then i scoring 3+ goal in game. Lets see what it does in this season.

 

 

 

Edited October 25, 2022 by Legend288

[Legend288]

[MikeF]

You’re using the corner exploit right? Varane scored 32 goals. Can’t really comment on the tactic if using that. 

Edited October 25, 2022 by MikeF

[Helio]

5 hours ago, MikeF said:

You’re using the corner exploit right? Varane scored 32 goals. Can’t really comment on the tactic if using that. 

This has really killed the game this year. The corner exploit made it difficult to assess tactics. 

 

I am wondering how the dev could not fix this easily with the handfuls of updates we got.

 

It's like a shortcut that AI never takes in a racing game.

[hhooo]

5 hours ago, MikeF said:

You’re using the corner exploit right? Varane scored 32 goals. Can’t really comment on the tactic if using that. 

I didn't use it for my results, but 32 goals from a sweeper would indicate that. 

 

I used mixed corner delivery and probably got ten goals across the season from them.

[MikeF]

4 hours ago, hhooo said:

I didn't use it for my results, but 32 goals from a sweeper would indicate that. 

 

I used mixed corner delivery and probably got ten goals across the season from them.

Yeah I didn’t mean yours. Sorry. The formation looks really interesting. IWB in line with CB certainly play like wide CB in a back three in this version of the game in this tactic. Great research into the other roles too.

[MikeF]

4 hours ago, Helio said:

This has really killed the game this year. The corner exploit made it difficult to assess tactics.

Yeah it’s such a bug getting a goal a game or more for free. Should be fixed but I remember this being a thing in football manager on the PC a decade ago or so, so I just choose not to use it.

[MikeF]

Unless I’m doing 1k 😂